The Future of Energy Leadership with Stephen Preng

[00:00:00] Josh Lowrey: Welcome to the Energy Pipeline Podcast. My name is Josh Lowery. We are coming to you live from the Upright Digital Media studio in the Prange and Associates office in Houston, Texas. I am joined today with a good friend and colleague, Mr. Stephen Prange. Stephen, what are ... You are the consultant and practice leader of Global Energy Services at Prange and Associates.

[00:00:22] Josh Lowrey: That's right. How are you, sir?

[00:00:23] Stephen Preng: I'm good. How are you?

[00:00:24] Josh Lowrey: How do you think I did on that intro?

[00:00:27] Stephen Preng: Sounded pretty solid, like we barely know each other.

[00:00:31] Josh Lowrey: Yeah, well, to be honest with you, it was your title that I almost messed up, 'cause I don't ever introduce you with your title when we see each other at these events.

[00:00:40] Stephen Preng: I don't ever in- introduce myself with my title either. Um, partner maybe, but, you know.

[00:00:45] Josh Lowrey: That's probably what I would've said if I hadn't have looked at this. I would've said partner/president maybe. Um, is David ... Is ... I mean, what ... David's founder of Prange and Associates.

[00:00:55] Stephen Preng: Founder, managing partner.

[00:00:58] Josh Lowrey: Yeah.

[00:00:59] Stephen Preng: [00:01:00] Um

[00:01:03] Stephen Preng: Yeah. Uh, he, we ca- we call him the managing partner still, though he's, he's, he's pulling back from the business a little by little.

[00:01:11] Josh Lowrey: Yeah. Well, David's... I mean, look, you guys, I always talk about there's... I came from a, I came from a family business, and the reason I'm making a big difference, uh, differentiator on the word family business versus a business that has family, as I view this as a business that has family.

[00:01:27] Stephen Preng: That's correct.

[00:01:28] Josh Lowrey: Yeah. Where I came from a family business. And it's, um, the way you guys run this, I mean, you guys are international. You've been international for how, how long?

[00:01:38] Stephen Preng: So this is our 46th year. We've had London for over 30. Wasn't that cl- 32, 33 years.

[00:01:43] Josh Lowrey: Mm-hmm.

[00:01:43] Stephen Preng: We used to have the first Western-owned recruiting office in Russia, and that was in '94.

[00:01:49] Stephen Preng: So 32 years. And I ran that from... I was out there from '04 to '09. Um, and we shut that down in '12. So, uh, uh, but London's maintained. We've been [00:02:00] international and global. I, I, I, the stat is, like, 3,000, you know, more than 3,000 assignments in 96-something countries worldwide.

[00:02:09] Josh Lowrey: Wow. Okay. Yeah, I mean, this is not a, this is not a small operation.

[00:02:13] Josh Lowrey: You guys... But at the same time, you're nimble, and we're, we're gonna talk about this in a minute. You, I always compliment the Prange Associates group. You guys fight way above your weight, it feels like. You guys are fighting with... I actually thought when I first met you guys that you were probably 10X the size of what you are, um, because I didn't really, I didn't understand that you weren't a massive team because the people you guys compete with-

[00:02:38] Stephen Preng: Right

[00:02:38] Josh Lowrey: is way larger than you- Correct ... in terms of personnel, resources. But you guys are in there fighting with the big guys, so.

[00:02:45] Stephen Preng: Yeah. Well, you've got five global search firms, major search firms, um, that do, you know, name a practice, name an industry, they've got 100 practices with 200 offices around the globe.

[00:02:58] Josh Lowrey: Right.

[00:02:59] Stephen Preng: We compete with their [00:03:00] energy practice.

[00:03:00] Josh Lowrey: Okay.

[00:03:01] Stephen Preng: Uh, and that's all we do. Now, energy's a much broader term today than when Dad started the company. Dad came out of Shell. The legacy history of our business has been around oil and gas, whether it's upstream, midstream, downstream, um, service and equipment, which, you know, I run that practice.

[00:03:17] Stephen Preng: But really expanded in the last five-plus years, uh, I'd say even a little bit before that. Uh, we brought in our partner in Chicago, Mark Zilek, so our power practice is just booming.

[00:03:28] Josh Lowrey: Mm.

[00:03:29] Stephen Preng: Uh, and we go toe-to-toe with the big search firms across the energy spectrum.

[00:03:34] Josh Lowrey: So one of my favorite- I don't know if joke is the right word, maybe internet troll line that I like to do with David and the Praying and Associates group is you guys are not recruiters.

[00:03:47] Stephen Preng: Correct.

[00:03:47] Josh Lowrey: Yes.

[00:03:48] Stephen Preng: He'll be quick to tell you that too.

[00:03:49] Josh Lowrey: Yes. So, um, there is a... You know, we have other friends that don't sell insurance, they sell risk, and honestly, they don't. They are very c- they are much better at [00:04:00] selling what their services are versus a product, right, than their widget. Um, do me a favor and explain to the audience what Praying and Associates does.

[00:04:08] Josh Lowrey: Well- 'Cause I don't want them thinking you guys are recruiters.

[00:04:11] Stephen Preng: Right. R- recruitment's just a piece of finding and attracting somebody. We run a process.

[00:04:17] Josh Lowrey: Okay.

[00:04:17] Stephen Preng: And our process is to find the best person possible for the role that we're retained to go find And to be honest, the secret sauce of the reason you're hiring a Pring and Associates, uh, as I mentioned, been around 46 years, our network's second to none in the industry.

[00:04:34] Stephen Preng: And so we know or are one person removed from almost anybody we wanna get to. And that process to get there, to get to the end game, may look the same as just doing a recruiting assignment, but it's the process that gets there. It's the evaluation, it's the referencing, it's the back channel referencing.

[00:04:53] Stephen Preng: It's the understanding where those people have been. We know the companies they've been in, the management teams they've been involved with, all the experience that they've [00:05:00] had that our clients are looking for. We know that. And it's not just pulling off a resume off of- Yeah ... one of the recruiting- LinkedIn or whatever

[00:05:08] Stephen Preng: websites and just saying, "I hope this fits."

[00:05:11] Josh Lowrey: You know, we, um, we're doing this interview right after lunch. Um, the reason I bring that up is we went to lunch together, and I feel like I've got a pretty good network. We've- have other friends that have really good networks. But while we were at lunch, I'm trying to think how many people stopped you before, before we got to lunch, during lunch, and then on our way out from lunch, and then in the parking lot to come back to the building.

[00:05:39] Josh Lowrey: It was in the six or seven number.

[00:05:41] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:05:42] Josh Lowrey: How many people- Well- ... stopped me? Nobody. Well, one. I saw one guy that we knew together, and- I

[00:05:48] Stephen Preng: think he just hid ...

[00:05:49] Josh Lowrey: he was hiding- Yeah ... and I caught him, and I had to buy him ice cream, but that was really for me. Um, but my point is, is that y- that you guys are [00:06:00] incredibly well-networked.

[00:06:01] Josh Lowrey: Um, this was not... And you weren't doing anything. We were just walking to lunch.

[00:06:06] Stephen Preng: Yeah. You have to be in what we do. Right. I mean, that, that's, again, that's the lifeblood of what we are. Um, and you know, it kinda starts with the way my dad built this practice and treating people right, um, clients and candidates.

[00:06:21] Stephen Preng: And, you know, it's enabled us to really expand and get to know a ton of people. And, um, I feel like, you know, that network that we've built is incredible. We happen to be eating lunch and close to our office, which helps. That's our- I mean, we weren't- ... my little, my little bubble ...

[00:06:37] Josh Lowrey: we weren't across the street though.

[00:06:38] Stephen Preng: No. I mean, it

[00:06:38] Josh Lowrey: was... Yeah.

[00:06:39] Stephen Preng: But yeah, I mean, and, but we know a lot of people.

[00:06:44] Josh Lowrey: Yeah.

[00:06:44] Stephen Preng: I mean, that's, that's a fact.

[00:06:47] Josh Lowrey: Uh, well, again, I, it was very obvious that it was... And, and the one guy, I, I saw him beeline away from his Suburban to come over and run to say hello. "Hey, I haven't seen you in quite a while. How you been?"

[00:06:55] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:06:55] Josh Lowrey: So, um, all right. So you guys, you're not... And the other thing that matters, too, is [00:07:00] who you're... But let's, we'll come back to that I, this, I almost phrased this to where, who is Stephen Pring? Who, who are you, Stephen? Give the people... You're obviously an executive recruiter, but I'm looking at this. You didn't start till 2010.

[00:07:14] Josh Lowrey: What were you doing?

[00:07:15] Stephen Preng: What- Well, I, I actually did start out, uh, we had, my dad and I built a separate company that does recruiting at a lower level, and I got my hands dirty doing that. Well, you know, if you rewind back, all the Pring kids, I think, worked at Pring and Associate at some point through high school, so, and Dad was the kind of guy that brought it home, so grew up around the business.

[00:07:38] Stephen Preng: But I started my own company, uh, back in 2002, built that up. I've handed off the reins to another individual. She's running that, doing extremely well. And so I joine- joined the Pring side in 2010. Um-

[00:07:52] Josh Lowrey: I didn't realize you'd started that other company. I know what you're talking about.

[00:07:54] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:07:54] Josh Lowrey: Okay.

[00:07:54] Stephen Preng: Uh, and it's doing extremely well.

[00:07:56] Stephen Preng: Uh, Amanda Dale runs that company, and she does a great job for [00:08:00] us. Amanda did work at Pring, and then, uh, I asked her to come over and take over that business, and she's done a great job with that. But, um, yeah, this, I... When I got out of school, you know, going to Pring and Associates was a natural fit. Um, you know, older brother and sister had, uh, different opportunities, did, did something different, even though my sister works with us now as a partner in the firm.

[00:08:24] Stephen Preng: Um, so there was no child to hand the business off to, and, and my, you know, that was okay. But I, I was always interested in, in what we did. And so having the opportunity to come in, join the Pring side, I, like I said, I spent some time out in our, our, our Moscow office, uh, which was, you know, a great opportunity in itself.

[00:08:46] Stephen Preng: Um, really enabled me to, to become the professional I am today.

[00:08:50] Josh Lowrey: Okay. And you moved from... Y- the reason, it's not lo- it's just different le- levels of the business, 'cause now you're primarily dealing with CEOs, board [00:09:00] members, private equity. Yeah,

[00:09:01] Stephen Preng: yeah. This was, Energy Careers does more, uh, individual contributors and middle management.

[00:09:06] Josh Lowrey: Okay.

[00:09:06] Stephen Preng: So just lower on the organizational chart.

[00:09:08] Josh Lowrey: Okay. Now you're doing senior-

[00:09:10] Stephen Preng: Now we do board of directors, C-suite, and, and that executive leadership team that reports into the C-suite.

[00:09:15] Josh Lowrey: So I've, it's been funny. I've always tried to, like, bring you, if I know a, a CFO, I'm like, "Hey, here's a, this guy's looking for a job."

[00:09:23] Josh Lowrey: You're like, "That's great. We, we need to know that guy," or, "We already know that guy." But you're really talking to companies that are growing quickly. Um, I'm, I'm actually, I've been blown away kind of knowing you and watching the business. I didn't realize how many companies outsource this. I just kind of assumed that everybody had a big network.

[00:09:46] Stephen Preng: Well- Getting the wrong hire, especially at an executive level, can be extremely expensive. So a lot of times we're risk mitigation. [00:10:00] Uh, we have the network, we have the contacts, we understand the business. We're a different set of eyes, evaluation. Um, and frankly, if you're running a successful company, you're too busy to be doing this.

[00:10:12] Josh Lowrey: Mm-hmm.

[00:10:13] Stephen Preng: I'll be honest, we're terrible at when we wanna go find somebody for our Pring and Associates, we're all too busy doing it. We're doing this for somebody else. Yeah. And so-

[00:10:21] Josh Lowrey: The cobbler's son has no shoes.

[00:10:23] Stephen Preng: It's... Exactly. Yeah. And so it, it's, um, you know, if you got a, a, a, just like at Upright and other companies, you know, you're, you're too busy doing your day job to go focus on other stuff, and that's where we come in.

[00:10:36] Stephen Preng: Um, but again, it also comes back to our network, our knowledge of the space, what our clients do, what makes people successful, uh, and being able to get that fit.

[00:10:49] Josh Lowrey: I think one of the other things I'm always blown away is how many events you guys attend. Like, I attend a lot of events, but I feel like you guys are [00:11:00] 2X, 3X.

[00:11:01] Stephen Preng: Yeah. Uh, it's w- I think it's one of the things we do best, to be honest. Um, again, the big search firms don't spend a lot, and they don't have to. Uh, they've got the global brand. Uh, they've got partners around the world who have connections that will recommend other partners for searches in different industries.

[00:11:21] Stephen Preng: You know, it's just us here. So it's us, us going to battle, uh, and we've gotta go develop our network and pick up the, pick up the work. Uh-

[00:11:28] Josh Lowrey: R- real quick, when, when you say pick up the work, I want the audience to understand what you're really talking about. Y- it's not, "Hey, I'm Steven Prag. I need to go meet Josh Lowry," right?

[00:11:36] Josh Lowrey: That's, that's part of it, but you need to meet... Well, you don't need to meet Josh Lowry the contributor. You need to meet Josh Lowry the CEO who's gonna grow or start a new expansion of a new division that's gonna be looking for a president, CFO, CEO. That's the Josh Lowry you need to meet, is somebody like that, that's gonna be, "Look, hey, Steven, great timing.

[00:11:54] Josh Lowrey: Um, I need, I'm gonna need somebody in the next six months. We should engage now." That's... When you say engagement, [00:12:00] that's what you're looking for.

[00:12:00] Stephen Preng: Correct. Uh, our business is not transactional. Uh, hardly ever do you call on somebody with the expectation of a search being on the... It's all relationship driven.

[00:12:11] Stephen Preng: Like a lot of, uh, services businesses, it's, it's relationship driven. So for us, developing those relationships, and honestly some of the best time is when you're at these conferences, when the CEOs and CFOs and other leaders are already committed to being there. Their time's carved off. They're not focused on what they're doing day to day.

[00:12:31] Stephen Preng: I mean, take, you know, any CEO that I, I do work for, I can't call them up and say, "Hey, I wanna come by and see you," and expect them to have the time. They may, um, but it's easier to go find them when they're gonna have the time- Mm-hmm ... because you know they're gonna be at one of the Daniel events, one of the EWTC events, et cetera.

[00:12:53] Stephen Preng: And, and so for us, taking adva- Or the Upright

[00:12:55] Josh Lowrey: events.

[00:12:56] Stephen Preng: Yeah, the Upright events, ab- absolutely. Um, taking [00:13:00] advantage at, of that stuff is, uh, something we've done extremely well.

[00:13:05] Josh Lowrey: So producer Caitlin, or PC as we're calling her now, uh, she is phenomenal with her note development, and she has given me some phenom- And one of the things she wrote here is that you have some of the best views on the industry, leadership trends, executive hiring, workf- force development- Oh, absolutely

[00:13:23] Josh Lowrey: industry sentiment, M&A, private equity priorities, et cetera. That's one of the things, every time I talk to you, you're like, "Hey, did you see X, Y, or Z? Did you know about this?" And I'm like, "No, I, I didn't." Uh, like, what are you reading on a daily, weekly, or watching? Like, how are you keeping up with all this?

[00:13:43] Stephen Preng: Um, we do have a fantastic, uh, research team, uh, that kind of channels a bunch of, uh...

[00:13:52] Stephen Preng: all the updates, whether it's public, private, anything we can get our hands on. Obviously, uh, in today's world with, um, your, your, the [00:14:00] ability to obtain news and information, um, trying to find, you know, trying to keep our eyes on everything we can. And again, going back to kind of the networking and the talking to people, the best news is usually word of mouth, word of mouth of, from, you know, uh, whether it's clients in the know, it's people in the industry, you know, talking to candidates, what are they hearing?

[00:14:22] Stephen Preng: And so all of it is just you, you accumulate all of it. What do

[00:14:25] Josh Lowrey: you mean you have a research- you have an internal research team that you guys work with?

[00:14:28] Stephen Preng: Yep. Yep. We have two, um, uh, school of mine grads that are extremely bright, great energy, and that, that delivers all kinds of information. I

[00:14:35] Josh Lowrey: didn't know.

[00:14:35] Josh Lowrey: That's great. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So, and when, so the process i- in, what, what all do they get ready for you guys when you guys are preparing a, a search or you're preparing- Well- ... a presentation? ...

[00:14:46] Stephen Preng: sort of all the above. They'll do that. They do a great job with presentation and re- and re- uh, but also identification of people in the market, going th- through, whether it's in our system and identifying people we know.

[00:14:57] Stephen Preng: If it's going through external resources like LinkedIn, et [00:15:00] cetera, and identify people we don't know. Um, but also anything that hits the Newswire, anything that can possibly be informative, they'll send it to us. Sometimes it's, you can look at it and you, you move on- Okay ... and, and it's not, but a lot of times it's, it's good data.

[00:15:15] Josh Lowrey: Okay. Trying to think what I wanna talk about here, Steven. We've interviewed... By the way, we are in the Prange Associates office

[00:15:25] Stephen Preng: That's right

[00:15:25] Josh Lowrey: And just so the audience knows, like, this wasn't an accident for us. Like, we looked at this and thought... 'Cause we, we have another studio. We have one down in the Heights.

[00:15:37] Josh Lowrey: You guys are Memorial. Um, location-wise, it's great. This is a lot of senior leaders down Energy Corridor here, obviously. It's convenient for them. But we also knew how many people were coming into this office, how many senior level people were gonna be in here. And, you know, we identified our, our friends, partners, and as, and customers really as a, [00:16:00] this is a smart place to put our brand.

[00:16:03] Josh Lowrey: I mean, the- you guys do... It feels like Prange has their finger on the pulse of the industry. It just does. And, you know, I, I go through this, and it's, and it's not just oil and gas and energy. It's industrials. It's the private equity. Out, out of all the things that you guys are looking at right now, we hear AI, data, we hear energy.

[00:16:23] Josh Lowrey: Uh, you mentioned power.

[00:16:24] Stephen Preng: Yep.

[00:16:25] Josh Lowrey: Are they all on fire? Like, what is it, what is it from that side of things?

[00:16:29] Stephen Preng: Uh, so on the people side- The power spectrum with AI and data s-, I mean, that, that's, that's the strongest market out there. Um, it, you know, we went to the Sonoma conference a couple weeks ago. The amount of money that's going in that direction is just...

[00:16:50] Stephen Preng: It's, it's funny money almost. Yeah. It's just crazy to think of. And so there's a lot of people chasing that, and that means they need to go find people that can lead teams, et cetera. [00:17:00] And so that's the hottest, hottest place, hottest spot for people right now. Mm-hmm. But talent across the board, there's, you know, I- it's really, I, I would say pretty balanced when you get back to the legacy oil and gas space.

[00:17:13] Stephen Preng: Uh, upstream's maybe a little tighter, um, but there's still activity that we're seeing out there. Service and equipment, um, I, I, I'm seeing a lot of opportunity, and there's a lot of need for talent. I think people see a market that's got s- some potential tailwinds to it, and for one reason or not, they wanna go find talent to match that.

[00:17:38] Stephen Preng: Maybe it's upgrading something they currently have or looking for something they don't have to go, you know, go build out something. So...

[00:17:45] Josh Lowrey: That's the energy services market? Correct. So we had a guest on, I don't know, the last couple weeks, and he said that we are at the end of the great crew change. Would you agree with that statement?

[00:17:59] Stephen Preng: [00:18:00] Yeah, I would. I mean, they've been talking about that since I joined the, the industry 20 years ago The, the crew change Yeah The great crew change For, like, 20 years.

[00:18:06] Josh Lowrey: By the way, I, I wonder how long I've been hearing about it. Ob- obviously, we've heard about it for a while.

[00:18:11] Stephen Preng: So I'm talking about back in early 2000s, I said this was going to happen.

[00:18:16] Stephen Preng: There was going... There's going to be a-

[00:18:19] Josh Lowrey: Crew change

[00:18:19] Stephen Preng: Yeah. And I feel like the last 10 years they've been talking about that's c- it's coming to an end. Um-

[00:18:26] Josh Lowrey: Hmm ...

[00:18:27] Stephen Preng: I think some of it, people work a little bit longer now. Uh, you know, to be honest, when I started, if somebody was 60, um, people looked at you like you were, you were done.

[00:18:40] Stephen Preng: Now 60 is, nobody blinks at it. And just, so people work longer than they, they used to.

[00:18:47] Josh Lowrey: I can't even imagine retiring at 60, now that I think about it.

[00:18:49] Stephen Preng: Well, Dave Pring is s- I don't wanna say his age, but he's-

[00:18:53] Josh Lowrey: He's, he's older than

[00:18:53] Stephen Preng: 60 ... he's older than that, and, uh- He- ... he's not going anywhere.

[00:18:56] Josh Lowrey: Well, he looks great.

[00:18:57] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:18:57] Josh Lowrey: I just feel like, uh, Kaitlin, producer [00:19:00] Kaitlin's gonna get mad at this comment, but my joke, and it's not a joke, like nobody, nobody wants to talk to me anymore 'cause I talk about AI and peptides. Like everything, it's all, it's my two subjects. Those are your two

[00:19:10] Stephen Preng: facts.

[00:19:11] Josh Lowrey: And it is, everyone's just healthier.

[00:19:14] Josh Lowrey: They're doing more, they're working out. And, you know, 60 seems very... I have a friend of mine, he's like, "I, fi- three more years, I'll be 60, I'm gonna retire." And I'm like, "What are you talking about?" I guess if, if you have money and you retire, then do it. It seems like a bad idea to me.

[00:19:30] Stephen Preng: It's also, it's also, you know, if you love what you do, does it really work?

[00:19:34] Stephen Preng: And, you know, I really like what I do.

[00:19:37] Josh Lowrey: Yeah.

[00:19:37] Stephen Preng: I, I enjoy my job, uh, coming to work every day. I'm nowhere near the love my dad has for the search business. I, I, he, he truly- He loves it ... he truly loves it. He truly loves it. When he puts- What

[00:19:48] Josh Lowrey: does he love about it? I mean, I, I wanna

[00:19:50] Stephen Preng: hear- Putting, putting, when he puts in a candidate into a role with a company that needs this person, and that person goes in and drives value and success, [00:20:00] like to him, that is, he calls this, can be the marriage maker.

[00:20:04] Stephen Preng: And for him, that just, I mean, that just makes his world.

[00:20:06] Josh Lowrey: I love that.

[00:20:07] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:20:08] Josh Lowrey: I will give one of our mutual friends, John. When I, before I met David, he said, he said, he's like, "Careful with David. He's..." Because David's a very serious man, and, you know, I've been known to not be serious at some times in my life.

[00:20:25] Josh Lowrey: And he said, just, he goes, "Your humor isn't David's humor, so just be, be careful." And I have never found that.

[00:20:33] Stephen Preng: No.

[00:20:33] Josh Lowrey: Every time I tell a joke, he laughs. Well, not every time, but-

[00:20:35] Stephen Preng: As long as you don't call him a recruiter, you're okay.

[00:20:38] Josh Lowrey: I did that once just to see his flick on his face. Yeah. Didn't get locked out of the room then.

[00:20:41] Josh Lowrey: I didn't do it twice. I didn't do it twice. But I mean, you know, it is, uh, do you guys, are you big believers in personality tests for yourselves and for your candidates?

[00:20:52] Stephen Preng: So yes, uh- My sister's Hogan certified. I think we have another individual-

[00:20:58] Josh Lowrey: Hogan? I don't know

[00:20:59] Stephen Preng: Hogan ... Hogan's probably [00:21:00] the largest- whole food

[00:21:00] Stephen Preng: or one of the largest, uh, assessment Out there?

[00:21:07] Josh Lowrey: Is, is that- Person I- I hate to sound stupid, but I'm, I'm un-Hoganed. Is that like a disc or that the Berkman Is it along those lines?

[00:21:17] Stephen Preng: It's, it's along those lines. Okay. You go in and you answer, do you like red or green? Do you like blah, blah, blah. I'm, I'm making this up.

[00:21:23] Josh Lowrey: Yeah, I understand.

[00:21:23] Stephen Preng: You know? And then it comes up with and it tells you why you get scared in certain ways and your, how you act- First of all,

[00:21:29] Josh Lowrey: I'm never scared ... well- But go ahead, yeah.

[00:21:31] Stephen Preng: And so it's a, it's... Again, that just adds to the data point that we add, too. So, uh, we have a third party that we will channel those through.

[00:21:41] Stephen Preng: Uh, some of the big firms have their own, and we think that's a little conflictive to have, um, you know, somebody, one of your partners down the hall running the- Yeah ... personality test.

[00:21:51] Josh Lowrey: You're great.

[00:21:51] Stephen Preng: Yeah. Um, yeah, make this sound like this. Um, so we, we outsource that. A lot of clients have their own, uh, too, and...

[00:21:59] Stephen Preng: or, [00:22:00] you know, they have their own preference on which one they wanna use- A Birkman

[00:22:02] Josh Lowrey: or whatever, right?

[00:22:03] Stephen Preng: Yeah. Uh, there's the Harrison, there's the Hogan, there's a Bir- Yeah ... yeah, the Birk- I mean, there's an, there's a thousand different tools to, to... that-

[00:22:11] Josh Lowrey: Do you guys know why you settle on the Hogan?

[00:22:13] Stephen Preng: Um, just because- It sounds like it's been around a long time

[00:22:17] Stephen Preng: it's one of the o- it's, it's been around a long time. It's one of the largest ones out there. It's kind of a widely accepted- I'm gonna take it ... assessment.

[00:22:23] Josh Lowrey: I, I've t- we've... You know, listen, I sh- I do... The reason I'm asking these questions is clearly David, and I would imagine many people in your business, they're almost like a business-style matchmaker.

[00:22:37] Josh Lowrey: Um, you know, the old, the old school matchmaker for getting people married type thing.

[00:22:41] Stephen Preng: Right.

[00:22:41] Josh Lowrey: There's a, there is something in their personality that says, "I, I see the vision. I see where this is going. This person needs to meet that person, connect." And then they're, they feel satisfaction in that, right?

[00:22:52] Josh Lowrey: They're... And so he obviously has some type of personality connection in there that, that that's where he's [00:23:00] wired. And I'm, I would just wonder, um, if you guys have ever taken those tests, if you've ever had that kind of stuff, too. But-

[00:23:06] Stephen Preng: We have. We've taken the Hogan. Uh, it's been a couple years since I took it, but yeah.

[00:23:10] Stephen Preng: I mean, it, it's not one of the tests that says, you know, "Do you wanna be a firefig- you'll be a firefighter or whatever when you grow up." It's more of how you, your personality reacts in certain situations and stuff. But it, it's, it's, it's interesting what, how, what it comes back with 'cause it, they're fairly accurate.

[00:23:25] Josh Lowrey: Well, see, that actually does kinda surprise me that it's not, "You'll be a firefighter," in considering the type of work that you guys are doing.

[00:23:31] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:23:31] Josh Lowrey: I would think that one that would say, "I wanna be a CFO." And we had Marshall Dotson on here, and he said something about ta- he was talking about the financials, and he's like, "Well, it's, you know, then that's PBT," and he kept moving on.

[00:23:45] Josh Lowrey: And I said, "Peanut butter toast?" And he's like, you know, "Uh, profit before taxes, Josh." And so clearly if I said, "I wanna be a CFO," and I thought PBT was peanut butter toast, then you would be... you'd say, "Well, your test [00:24:00] says you should not be the CFO," right? Is... But w- what I'm... It'll be... I'll, I'm gonna look up the Hogan versus the why shouldn't you be a firefighter t- But,

[00:24:09] Stephen Preng: but it's not a strengths and weaknesses, that your strengths in finance, your strengths in this It's a personality.

[00:24:13] Stephen Preng: How do you react in search of certain situations? So it's more of your leadership s- skills, how do they come through in different scenarios?

[00:24:20] Josh Lowrey: Yeah.

[00:24:21] Stephen Preng: And so defining how you are a leader, it's not really necessary, kinda relevant to your skill set if I'm a CFO or chief commercial officer-

[00:24:31] Josh Lowrey: Right ...

[00:24:31] Stephen Preng: or whatnot.

[00:24:32] Stephen Preng: It's more how do I operate, how do I lead, how do I, uh, react and when the going gets tough, et cetera. And which is critical for clients w- when you're trying to assess data if you have three or four really good candidates that all- Yeah ... look really good, it's how do you make the dec- deciding factor, um, between one or the other?

[00:24:53] Stephen Preng: That is the answer. And so the more data-

[00:24:54] Josh Lowrey: That's interesting ...

[00:24:55] Stephen Preng: the more data you can gather, the better- Yeah ... you know, it's an educated guess, but the more [00:25:00] educated you can get, the better the guess becomes.

[00:25:01] Josh Lowrey: Well, I mean, actually you just kind of answered the question. You're not... You already know that the guy should be a firefighter.

[00:25:07] Stephen Preng: Right.

[00:25:07] Josh Lowrey: It's, that's not the question. Right. He's already proven that he's a great firefighter.

[00:25:10] Stephen Preng: Right.

[00:25:11] Josh Lowrey: It's, and you have three great firefighters. It's like which one, let's put the, you know, that's a... Let's put the one that's gonna fit with this organization the best. You, y- these, they're all three great candidates- Right

[00:25:23] Josh Lowrey: or we wouldn't even be talking about them.

[00:25:25] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:25:25] Josh Lowrey: Ca- Uh, Producer Caitlin, can you look up, uh, the Hogan test and find one of those that we can take later before I forget this? Thank you, PC. See how long I get away with doing this.

[00:25:37] Stephen Preng: Well, and, and just on, on the assessment piece, and, and you talked about it, it's about the fit.

[00:25:42] Stephen Preng: We're, if we're looking at we're doing a CFO search for a client, and we've got, say we deliver five or six candidates on the shortlist and they wanna meet three or four.

[00:25:53] Josh Lowrey: Okay.

[00:25:54] Stephen Preng: And they really like three that stand out. How do they d- decide the differ- they're all [00:26:00] good CFOs. Right. They're all pro- I mean, at our level, the people recruiting are proven.

[00:26:03] Stephen Preng: They've been there, they've done that. Right. So it's not, "Hey, can this person do debits and credits or whatever?" Mm-hmm. I mean, the, the, you know, this person's got the experience. Y- you may be attracted to somebody more because they've been at a public company versus a private company, and that's, you know, that's a differentiator, but when they're all fairly equal on, on the same playing field, it's who fits.

[00:26:23] Stephen Preng: And this is, and, and, and it's as, as import- a- as important, or more important than anything, is the culture fit. You hear about it all the time, whether at these, we're at these conferences or you're talking to anybody. Culture fit, people talk about the culture of the organization. Yeah. How important is it to them?

[00:26:38] Stephen Preng: Um, that's a real thing with most... Some people, it's lip service, but a lot of, a lot of organizations, it's a real thing. Ugh. It's critically important.

[00:26:45] Josh Lowrey: 100%.

[00:26:46] Stephen Preng: And so finding somebody that fits, I mean, we've seen it where we've done a lot of cleanup searches where we've had to come in, somebody talented's gone into an organization, they were a terrible fit.

[00:26:56] Stephen Preng: And, you know, we've come in and backfilled and found the right person for, [00:27:00] for that, for that role because, you know, not everyone's the right fit for every organization.

[00:27:04] Josh Lowrey: Just goes back to what you said earlier. The wrong hire is expensive.

[00:27:07] Stephen Preng: Absolutely.

[00:27:08] Josh Lowrey: Yeah. Um, what about tech- are you guys using new technologies for this stuff?

[00:27:14] Stephen Preng: We are. That goes back to my, uh, two super researchers. Uh, they're, they're using AI-

[00:27:20] Josh Lowrey: Yeah ...

[00:27:20] Stephen Preng: um, quite a bit. At will. Quite a bit. And it, it's fascinating to see the improvements in AI catch up with the things that we're looking for. Um, and the abil- and the ability to pull information at a rapid rate. Yeah.

[00:27:35] Stephen Preng: It's, it's pretty insane.

[00:27:37] Josh Lowrey: I mean, 'cause you guys have 30 years worth of history?

[00:27:40] Stephen Preng: 46.

[00:27:41] Josh Lowrey: I'm sc- I'm... Well, you're right. 46 years worth of, for instance, Hogan tests available. And, you know, I don't know what, how, percentage of people are still working out of those 46 years. Um, like when people sign up to be a candidate with Pring, are they saying, "Hey, I'd like you to consider me for the [00:28:00] next 12 months, to the next 12 years"?

[00:28:03] Stephen Preng: Well, that's not really how it works. Okay. You don't sign up. I mean, you can go onto our website and put your information in. Um, but we're, we're hired by a company to go find and fill a specific role. Mm-hmm. So you don't find us, we find you. And

[00:28:20] Josh Lowrey: that get- That's if you're a company that does an engagement with you But if I'm a firefighter, you want...

[00:28:27] Josh Lowrey: You're looking for firefighters at some level.

[00:28:29] Stephen Preng: Right. I'll go find the fire- They don't find us They

[00:28:31] Josh Lowrey: don't find... Oh, really? We find

[00:28:32] Stephen Preng: them.

[00:28:33] Josh Lowrey: Okay.

[00:28:33] Stephen Preng: Yeah. So we have to go find the company looking for the firefighters.

[00:28:39] Josh Lowrey: Mm-hmm.

[00:28:39] Stephen Preng: And then once we know that, we're at... We get hired by somebody to go find them, then we go find them.

[00:28:43] Josh Lowrey: Got it. Okay. And technology's making this easier to do, or just easier to, to take the information and use it once you have these people? Probably that second one.

[00:28:53] Stephen Preng: Uh, right now, I'd say the latter. Yeah. I, I'm, I'm assuming at some point it'll be all of the above. But, um, [00:29:00] you know, right now, technology's making my day-to-day job easier.

[00:29:04] Stephen Preng: I mean, there's-

[00:29:05] Josh Lowrey: You know, you just said something. I wish I could... It, it's former and the latter. I understand this, and I said the second. I wish I could just use it as quickly as you did, former and the latter. Why, why can't I pull that out quicker? Is it the former or the latter? This is, I'm just talking to myself.

[00:29:21] Stephen Preng: It's the latter.

[00:29:22] Josh Lowrey: I know it is. You said it right. I just don't know. I don't know why I said second. This is just me. I'm just a... Well- I think that ice cream at lunch was a bad idea. It slowed me down a little bit.

[00:29:34] Stephen Preng: I only had half of mine, so maybe I-

[00:29:36] Josh Lowrey: I ate all of it.

[00:29:38] Stephen Preng: We know. We saw the, we saw the-

[00:29:41] Josh Lowrey: Richard, what was really funny was I picked it back up to really finish the last scoop, and Richard thought I was done.

[00:29:47] Josh Lowrey: He's like, "Here, I'll take that," and I was like, "Okay." And I handed it to him, and I was like, well, in my head I'm thinking, "I'm not done with that," but that's fine.

[00:29:55] Stephen Preng: Saved you a couple calories.

[00:29:56] Josh Lowrey: Eh, I digress. Um, [00:30:00] well, all right. Let me see here. The state of the energy leadership. What separ- Let me, let me see if I wanna hear these.

[00:30:04] Josh Lowrey: Let me see if I wanna hear these answers from you, Stephen. What separ- Ooh, actually I do wanna hear this. I'd like to get your take on this. Um, what separates exceptional energy leaders from average ones? That's a great question.

[00:30:23] Stephen Preng: Could have prepped me on that one. Um-

[00:30:24] Josh Lowrey: No, no

[00:30:26] Stephen Preng: What-

[00:30:26] Josh Lowrey: All right, let's see. You bragged about your ice cream, only ate half. Let's see how s- smart you really are What

[00:30:30] Stephen Preng: separates exceptional leaders from average ones? Um

[00:30:39] Josh Lowrey: Or, okay, I'll tell you, I'll give you two scoops on here. What leadership traits are, are most in demand?

[00:30:46] Stephen Preng: Well, that's kinda answering the same question a little bit. I mean, I, exceptional leaders to me are people that get the team to buy in to the direction that they're going. They're the people that listen, not just talk, but [00:31:00] listen.

[00:31:01] Stephen Preng: They're the people that get people excited to come to work for them. Uh, and we see people all the time, and I, I, I can think of a couple people off the top of my head that I've placed over the years that, um, I know people love to work for, um, because they're just... They'll, they'll do everything they ask of people and be- and more-

[00:31:24] Josh Lowrey: Mm-hmm

[00:31:25] Stephen Preng: as a leader. So not just say, "Hey, I need to go, you need to go do this." They'll set the example.

[00:31:31] Josh Lowrey: Do it themselves as well.

[00:31:32] Stephen Preng: Do it themselves. They're not afraid to get their hands dirty- Right ... and do it. And, and so that's, to me, a lot what an exceptional leader is.

[00:31:40] Josh Lowrey: Do you call that servant leadership? I mean-

[00:31:42] Stephen Preng: That's one way that you could describe it.

[00:31:44] Stephen Preng: Yeah. Yeah.

[00:31:45] Josh Lowrey: Okay. Okay. I- I mean, the kinda, what leadership traits are most in demand? I mean, is that the same answers as the people-

[00:31:58] Stephen Preng: Leadership [00:32:00] traits most in demand, uh Honestly, I, it, that's gonna be situational company to company. Mm-hmm. And it's also gonna be market to market. In the current market where things look good, um, your leadership skill is about, I think, influence, pushing people to push themselves to do more.

[00:32:21] Stephen Preng: Um, you know, there's other markets that we've been through time and time again when you have COVID or other down markets that we see in the, in the oil and gas space, and those leadership skills, um, come in, look a little bit different of pe- what makes people successful. Uh, sometimes making hard decisions, it's not in everybody's DNA.

[00:32:41] Josh Lowrey: Yeah.

[00:32:42] Stephen Preng: Um, but those have to get done.

[00:32:45] Josh Lowrey: Are you a reader, like, for pleasure?

[00:32:47] Stephen Preng: Not for pleasure.

[00:32:48] Josh Lowrey: No? When you were coming up, did you read business books?

[00:32:52] Stephen Preng: A, a little bit, yeah.

[00:32:53] Josh Lowrey: Yeah. Is there one that you, that stuck out to you?[00:33:00]

[00:33:00] Stephen Preng: No, to be honest.

[00:33:01] Josh Lowrey: No?

[00:33:01] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:33:02] Josh Lowrey: No, my-- So I've got a 15-year-old, and I'm making him read, um, How to Win Friends and Influence People. And he's-- I mean, you know, he's a good-looking 15-year-old kid that is currently wearing me out this week, but that's a different subject. And he says, "I already have friends." I said, "Holcomb, it's not how to make friends and influence people.

[00:33:24] Josh Lowrey: It's how to win friends and influence people." Like, it's a very important difference between those two boo- those two words. And, you know, it is... I read that book early 20s, and I wish I would've read it when I was 15, and I'm, I'm gonna give him this book on how to win friends and influence people, and one of the chapters that sta- stuck with me forever was even, you know, on how, why not to argue with someone.

[00:33:50] Josh Lowrey: And I, I just think about little things that I've picked up over the last, you know, I'm 25 now. Obviously I look 25, 26. [00:34:00] And i- I'm just wondering, like, do these leaders that you're interviewing, are they, are they big readers? Do they read a lot? Are they, do they say... Is that something that the guys you're interviewing say, "Hey, we want somebody that's well-versed in this type of leadership," or, like, are you getting those types of specific q- requests, or they're just like, "Stephen and Pray- Prayne Associates, find us the person"?

[00:34:23] Stephen Preng: Yeah. I- We're more asked to go find somebody that has the right fit. Now, sometimes those leadership skills are a big piece of it. Um-

[00:34:36] Stephen Preng: But on the, another way of looking at it, those leadership skills of what driven people to be successful, so we're looking for people to go find that. They might not have said, "I've read this book or this book, and these kind of principles drive me," but you see it in their experience. Okay. If that makes sense.

[00:34:54] Stephen Preng: Yeah. So the answer is yes. I mean, [00:35:00] uh, we're always looking for good leaders. At the executive level, if you're not a good leader, we're not interested.

[00:35:05] Josh Lowrey: Well, uh, this, uh, question here that, you know, the different industries you guys are in, whether it be wealth and services, private equity, industrials, um, what else?

[00:35:14] Josh Lowrey: Technology, et cetera. Is the person, is it person agnostic, or is there a person that, for each industry? Like, in... I always heard somewhere that, uh, you know, Colin Cowherd, sports guy, who I love Colin Cowherd. This, I used to listen to him all the time. And he said, "You know, if Michael Jordan wasn't Michael Jordan the basketball player, he would've been Michael Jordan the lawyer in North Carolina, and he would've been great."

[00:35:44] Josh Lowrey: And because his j- his, his competitiveness was gonna drive him to be great at whatever he did. And his, his theory was that success is transferable. Like, if you're successful at this, you have the discipline of this, you're gonna be able to transfer that success to somewhere [00:36:00] else. Is... And I believe that.

[00:36:02] Josh Lowrey: That's my personal belief. Is that a... Are, if I'm good, if you're interviewing this firefighter, can that firefighter go be a great police officer? And I know I'm, I'm switching up. Sure. Yeah.

[00:36:14] Stephen Preng: Uh, well, I mean, I would agree and disagree with that com- with Co- Cowherd's comment. At the same time, I mean, Michael Jordan could hang in the air from the free throw line to the rim.

[00:36:23] Stephen Preng: Uh, most people can't do that, so. Sure.

[00:36:28] Stephen Preng: But his competitiveness was, is known as, you know, second to none.

[00:36:32] Josh Lowrey: Right.

[00:36:32] Stephen Preng: Um, so yeah, uh, leadership traits I think are transferable. Uh, skillsets, obviously technical skillsets is where you sort of get pigeonholed in where you're at. There's different personalities in different industries and, and different sectors in the energy space.

[00:36:52] Stephen Preng: And you know this, you've grown up in it, but people that are coming out of the upstream E&P side are not the same as the [00:37:00] folks that are doing- Correct ... oil field service. They,

[00:37:01] Josh Lowrey: they've- They're just not ...

[00:37:01] Stephen Preng: they know very

[00:37:02] Josh Lowrey: little about them too.

[00:37:03] Stephen Preng: They're just not. Um, and, uh, I won't say names, but a long time ago, a service company bought, uh, an, an oil and gas operator.

[00:37:15] Stephen Preng: Right. And I remember a gentleman I saw at one of the conferences made the comment that, you know, he... And it was his company. He said, "I'm, I'm the E&P guy. I don't bring donuts to anybody."

[00:37:26] Josh Lowrey: Mm.

[00:37:27] Stephen Preng: And it just, that, that had always stuck with me because I've got some, some of my best friends that are great sales guys, and they were happy to go bring donuts to folks and, and, you know, make relationships, because they love selling and that's what they love to do.

[00:37:43] Stephen Preng: Yeah. This person, that was- No chance ... s- there was no chance. Uh, I don't know if beneath him was the right opport- right word to say, but it kinda feels like it. Yeah. And, and it's a different mindset. You know, service people are there to serve, and they like it. They enjoy it. Um-

[00:37:59] Josh Lowrey: Well, you [00:38:00] know, if you're hungry, you'll do whatever.

[00:38:03] Stephen Preng: Correct.

[00:38:03] Josh Lowrey: You know what I mean? Like- Correct ... it's, it's an amazing thing where y-

[00:38:10] Josh Lowrey: I, look, we could spend an hour on that mindset, right? Like, people, it's... I guarantee the first person who built that E&P company that that gentleman worked for had a different mindset.

[00:38:23] Stephen Preng: Probably.

[00:38:23] Josh Lowrey: Definitely.

[00:38:24] Stephen Preng: I mean-

[00:38:25] Josh Lowrey: Uh-huh ...

[00:38:25] Stephen Preng: yeah. And this was-

[00:38:26] Josh Lowrey: And by the way, I'm not crapping on that guy- No, no ... by any means.

[00:38:28] Stephen Preng: No, no.

[00:38:28] Stephen Preng: This is, this is- You, you're right. You're right. Culturally ... obviously something that's been ingrained and-

[00:38:32] Josh Lowrey: 100% ...

[00:38:33] Stephen Preng: and learned, not, you know.

[00:38:35] Josh Lowrey: By the way, I'm not, I'm not, uh, crapping on that guy at all. I mean, ultimately, that is the... That's... I, I actually feel for that gentleman in many ways because I... If, if that was...

[00:38:46] Josh Lowrey: How long ago was that com- that comment?

[00:38:48] Stephen Preng: 15 years ago.

[00:38:49] Josh Lowrey: I don't think that guy survives today.

[00:38:51] Stephen Preng: Maybe 13... You know, 15, 13 years ago. Something like that.

[00:38:53] Josh Lowrey: Unless he's the smartest whatever at the E&P today and, and also well-established, [00:39:00] I don't think that that same person has that same career for the next 15 years that he might have just had for the last 15 years in today's market.

[00:39:06] Josh Lowrey: I feel like we are in an environment where you need to know a lot of things and do a lot of things and be willing to pick up a lot of buckets of water and carry them up the hill at all times. That's, again, that... Maybe that's just my service mind mentality. You know what I'm saying? It, it is.

[00:39:21] Stephen Preng: I think, uh, uh-

[00:39:22] Josh Lowrey: Yeah

[00:39:22] Stephen Preng: th- there's some of that, and I, I agree with both. I agree with what you said. I mean-

[00:39:26] Josh Lowrey: And I understand completely what you're

[00:39:27] Stephen Preng: saying ... information's so readily available, s- everything is so out there that I think, you know, that kind of old school take. But if you look at... I can think of at least three examples historically where an oilfield service company has acquired an E&P company-

[00:39:44] Josh Lowrey: Yeah

[00:39:45] Stephen Preng: and each were unsuccessful. And most of that is- Right.

[00:39:48] Josh Lowrey: Oilfield service company ...

[00:39:49] Stephen Preng: has acquired an E&P company.

[00:39:51] Josh Lowrey: Yeah.

[00:39:52] Stephen Preng: And each have been unsuccessful because of the culture, you know- Different ... trying to squeeze, uh... Yeah. I [00:40:00] agree. Trying to squeeze a E&P company into an O- OFS culture, 'cause cultures are just completely different.

[00:40:04] Josh Lowrey: Yes I

[00:40:07] Stephen Preng: mean,

[00:40:08] Josh Lowrey: have you ever been on a podcast before? Did I already ask you this?

[00:40:11] Stephen Preng: This is my second one. I, I think my dad and I did the, like, fourth or fifth-

[00:40:15] Josh Lowrey: Back in 2019

[00:40:17] Stephen Preng: or 2020 somewhere. Something like that, yeah. About, uh- So

[00:40:19] Josh Lowrey: that was six years ago. Uh, well-

[00:40:22] Stephen Preng: That, that was more Dave talking than me.

[00:40:24] Josh Lowrey: Yeah, that's right.

[00:40:26] Stephen Preng: I was just, I was just there for my good looks.

[00:40:29] Josh Lowrey: That, those were, those were crazy times back then. Yeah. That's right. Um, what do I wanna know here, Mr. Prang? What are the things I wanna know? D- I mean, do I wanna talk about AI, digital transformation leadership? Is that really impacting you guys right now? Are you guys being asked to get into the data center world at all, the AI?

[00:40:47] Stephen Preng: I mean, quite a bit. I mean- Are you? Yeah. Um, you know, this is where, you know, if you go back to- call it the energy [00:41:00] transition phase back in 2021, where you saw a lot of clients moving. We follow our clients just like a lot of people follow their clients, and so we've expand what i- you know, the term, what does energy mean today than-

[00:41:12] Josh Lowrey: Yeah

[00:41:13] Stephen Preng: uh, as I mentioned earlier on in the conversation. Historically, that side of the company was most, it was all oil and gas, upstream, midstream, downstream, all oil and gas focused. Then, you know, probably in the late '90s brought on, you know, my, uh, Charlie Carpenter, who's, uh, my former mentor and a, a, a client of ours ahead of time.

[00:41:32] Stephen Preng: Uh, and Charlie was, came out of the drilling business, huge service background, knew the space through and through. Charlie came on, and he's the one that brought me actually into Premium Associates in 2010 from our sister company into the service side. Um, but still, uh, if you looked at our search list back in 2010, there was maybe one or two power searches on there, and that, you know, mostly like with the utilities and, and, [00:42:00] and such.

[00:42:00] Stephen Preng: If you look at it today, if we're doing, I don't know, pick a number, if we've got 40 active searches across the, the firm, um, power's probably, you know, 15 of the 40, somewhere around that, 10 to 15. I mean, a good number. Uh, and so some of that, and, a- a- is the power side, the people that are producing power, et cetera, and that falls into, as I mentioned, our part- our partner in Chicago, Mark.

[00:42:30] Stephen Preng: Uh, and he's done a fantastic job building out that practice. Some of the, some of, of it is Mike, some are my clients, the, the equipment manufacturers that are... I mean, you look at the Solaires of the world who are just killing it.

[00:42:45] Josh Lowrey: Love those guys.

[00:42:46] Stephen Preng: Uh, yeah, those guys are great. I mean, Zartler was in here, you know, a couple months ago doing a podcast, and, um-

[00:42:51] Josh Lowrey: Did you guys place Kyle?

[00:42:53] Stephen Preng: No. I wish we would have.

[00:42:54] Josh Lowrey: No kidding. He's such a stud.

[00:42:55] Stephen Preng: Yeah. I wish we would have. Um-

[00:42:57] Josh Lowrey: He's such a stud ...

[00:42:58] Stephen Preng: so I mean, they [00:43:00] did an amazing job doing it, and others are following, and, and it's, it's working out for, for a lot of folks. But you see that migration, uh, that our clients are following n- new business, and we follow them with it.

[00:43:13] Stephen Preng: And so, um, yeah, and so the power world is, that's... And then go back to the conference we were at in Sonoma a couple weeks ago. Uh, it was a collision of oil and gas and, and-

[00:43:26] Josh Lowrey: Yeah ...

[00:43:26] Stephen Preng: AI data com- technology coming together, and that's what, that's what we're seeing.

[00:43:30] Josh Lowrey: There's a lot of great questions on this that I wanna get to.

[00:43:34] Josh Lowrey: Um, but I'm gonna pick two And man, this is really tough. And I wanna, I just wanna make a joke, but it's, it's just not funny enough for me to make it, but it's so great. How about Uh, like who is the one leader that left a lasting impression on you that you've worked with in the last th- 25, 30 years? 'Cause you've seen a lot of people.[00:44:00]

[00:44:01] Stephen Preng: Oh, how many times have-

[00:44:01] Josh Lowrey: Other than David You,

[00:44:05] Stephen Preng: you mean out of people that we've placed? Yeah. Uh, people we've come across in the industry? Um- Well, I mean, 'cause it's actually a

[00:44:13] Josh Lowrey: two-part question, right? Yeah. It says, it says, "What leadership lesson have you lear- which leader left a lasting impression?" Then, "What leadership lesson did you learn here?"

[00:44:25] Josh Lowrey: And yeah, myself and David are excluded. So that, that makes it a little easier for you

[00:44:30] Stephen Preng: Um

[00:44:39] Stephen Preng: Let me noodle on that one a minute. Okay. That's gonna take... That's a great question.

[00:44:42] Josh Lowrey: Isn't it great?

[00:44:43] Stephen Preng: That's a great question. But- '

[00:44:44] Josh Lowrey: Cause I feel like you guys have seen lots of phenom- Like you just mentioned Zartler.

[00:44:49] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:44:50] Josh Lowrey: This is my favorite thing about this industry. I said this yesterday, we were talking to somebody.

[00:44:54] Josh Lowrey: It, there needs to, there is, the people that we walk by, it's almost like pennies on the ground, honestly.

[00:44:59] Stephen Preng: Yeah. [00:45:00]

[00:45:01] Josh Lowrey: We're so... The leadership of people that we walk by, it's almost so commonplace, because they're just friends and you run into them so casually. You forget really who you're running into on a daily, weekly, monthly basis.

[00:45:16] Josh Lowrey: Because, "Oh, that's Steve, that's Bob, that's John." Right?

[00:45:19] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:45:19] Josh Lowrey: And they're not, though. These people are running 2,500-person companies, 10,000-person companies. They're publicly traded, they're flying here, they're, you know, they are literal captains of industry. And, you know, we interviewed... I, I could just, I could go on.

[00:45:35] Josh Lowrey: The men and women that we've interviewed in the last five or 10 years that are friends-

[00:45:41] Josh Lowrey: I, I mean, I can see where he's like, "Well, who did I learn the most from?" Um, Anne Fox. I'm just- I'm gonna- I'll answer this for you while you're noodling here. Dave and I interviewed Anne Fox, and, you know, I, I expected a good interview from her. I mean, she's got a great story, how she got to the position she was at.

[00:45:58] Josh Lowrey: And I [00:46:00] remember one thing about her interview, and it was right after she had a baby. Um, her company was in the midst of... It wasn't just her company, it's all companies. I'm gonna try to say this without crying, literally. Um, the company was... They were all failing. It wasn't her company. They were all failing.

[00:46:21] Josh Lowrey: This is like 2015, I believe, um, when oil was down, everything was down, services were down, layoffs were happening, et cetera, et cetera. Has the baby, and basically, the option is no option. I've got to go back to work. I've got to go help the team. They're making key decisions. They need me there. And the way she described going back into the office E- and it, David and I, DeRoad and I, couldn't help but kind of pull back in our chair physically, 'cause we're two dudes listening to a woman describe her physical thing that she was going through having just had a [00:47:00] baby that, uh, you know, women don't really describe that.

[00:47:03] Josh Lowrey: Business leaders don't describe that, and they certainly don't describe that to a podcast in front of two men with no other women in the room. And I remember just staring at her, and she bursts out laughing, and she's like, "Uh, guys, you should see your face right now." And then we all started cracking up because it was just, like, we were so taken aback with, like, this woman that was just talking about clearly her most vulnerable thing she'd ever been through in her entire life, and it was so powerful to see like, yeah, I was totally effed, and I was still marching on 'cause I had people that cared about me, and I had people that I cared about.

[00:47:39] Josh Lowrey: And like I'm, again, I'm tearing up telling the story because, you know... But, like, now I know her, right? And I've seen her for the last 10 years or whatever it is since that moment, and you realize that if you ask me this, what, who's one leader that left a lasting impression, I honestly think I might say Anne Fox.

[00:47:59] Josh Lowrey: [00:48:00] And because, you know, when your son asks, or son or daughter's like, you know, "Why do you get up so early?" Well, I don't, I don't want to get up early. I have to get up early. I have to go do these things. I have responsibilities. Anne did not wanna get out of bed. I'm sure of it. Yeah. I'm sure of it. She had to go do it.

[00:48:21] Josh Lowrey: And you d- like, these are the things that I think about in the world that you get to play with in, like, you're a professional services, you're an executive, you know, I understand what you do, but man, at some level you're touching a lot of really great people.

[00:48:35] Stephen Preng: Absolutely. So-

[00:48:38] Josh Lowrey: So I just answered that question for you.

[00:48:39] Stephen Preng: You did. You did a great job of answering that. Uh, you, you took away kinda my obvious answer. Obviously, my dad, the example that he set, but I'm a t- I'm gonna answer that anyways, and then I'll give a different answer. But yeah, I'm- Um, yeah, my dad started this business in 1980. Uh, [00:49:00] he had three young kids and, you know, decided it was time to go off on his own and, um-

[00:49:07] Josh Lowrey: And he did it to be fair.

[00:49:08] Josh Lowrey: He, he started the business because he didn't think that it was... people were being treated fairly at the other system.

[00:49:13] Stephen Preng: Correct. Well, and a, a big driver is that he, he, he could never wrap his hand, ha- heads around is the, the consulting model, you, they eat what you kill. And, uh, his, one of his first searches he ever had was a, a CFO search, and he said, "I had five great candidates."

[00:49:27] Stephen Preng: Uh, you know, the company hired one, and I had these four other candidates and, and, and the partner, you know, colleague, uh, one door down got a CFO search two weeks later and wouldn't ask him for who-

[00:49:39] Josh Lowrey: Would take,

[00:49:40] Stephen Preng: we need a call ... his colleagues because he didn't wanna, he didn't wanna carve off a percentage of his fee.

[00:49:45] Stephen Preng: And my dad said, "Well, that's not the right way to service clients." And, you know, and, and so Pring & Associates op- operates different. Uh, you hire one person at Pring, you hire the whole firm. Um, and so it's that mentality that I grew up with and that I see in, uh, i- he still, [00:50:00] when he comes in and walks the halls day to day.

[00:50:02] Stephen Preng: So I have to kinda answer, uh, my dad as one because I, I, I truly think that's the right answer. Um, you know, h- the way that he... uh, so his passion, his love- Yeah ... for what he does and everything like that, uh, it's second to none. And, and so to, to, to see that, to live that, to feed off that is, uh, has been tremendous.

[00:50:25] Stephen Preng: Uh, I'm also gonna go back and mention Charlie Carpenter who, um, rest in peace, passed away, uh, a year and a half ago. Um, but he was my mentor coming into the business. He taught me everything about oil field service and, and, and, and it's... John Goodrem and I always laughed when we would do a, uh, an OFS pitch and my dad would come in and whether he made the connection.

[00:50:48] Stephen Preng: And my dad knows oil field service, but he can't sell oil field service. It's just not his thing, so he goes back to stories from, like, 30 years ago. And John and I would be like, "Hey, s- stop talking. We got this." Um, [00:51:00] but Charlie knew it better than anybody. He was a CFO, but he was a good old boy. He knew the culture, and so kinda taught me about the people as well as the companies and what all the companies do and all that.

[00:51:12] Stephen Preng: Um- And so I've been lucky to have both of those as I've grown professionally. And then from a candidate side, I have met a tremendous amount of fascinating people. Um, there's been a handful of people throughout my career, like the minute you meet them, you know that's the guy or that's the gal for the role.

[00:51:35] Stephen Preng: Like, boom.

[00:51:35] Josh Lowrey: Yeah.

[00:51:36] Stephen Preng: Like, we can't just stop at one candidate, but you know who the right person is. And there's been a couple of those throughout my career, um, that I just have found s- some fascinating people, uh, that are just extremely impressive, great leaders, as I mentioned earlier, great re- leaders that listen.

[00:51:59] Stephen Preng: Uh, and when [00:52:00] they go to work and you put them in, they've been extremely successful. And that's honestly the best part about what we do.

[00:52:05] Josh Lowrey: I love it. Well, is there anything else people need to know about Prange & Associates and/or Steven Prange?

[00:52:17] Stephen Preng: I would say about Pring & Associates, uh, I don't like talking about myself, but about

[00:52:21] Josh Lowrey: the firm- I love talking about myself

[00:52:23] Stephen Preng: We know. Uh, about the firm, you know

[00:52:30] Stephen Preng: As we talked about earlier in, in, in the conversation, you know, we are the leading energy search firm out there. Right. Uh, there's, there's other good spots to go, but there's no firm that's as well as connected as we are. And again, I'll put our network up against anybody, and I'll put our track record up against anybody.

[00:52:52] Stephen Preng: Um, nobody's, uh, 100, 100% perfect in this world or, um, but our record's pretty [00:53:00] dang close. Um, and so, you know, as I mentioned a second ago, you hire one person, you hire the whole firm. I think that model and what, the way we operate really differentiates us to our competitors. Um, and it's enabled us to be successful for 46 years- That's incredible

[00:53:19] Stephen Preng: and beyond. We're gonna-

[00:53:20] Josh Lowrey: Yeah, you're not going anywhere.

[00:53:21] Stephen Preng: We're not going anywhere.

[00:53:22] Josh Lowrey: I love it.

[00:53:23] Stephen Preng: 50's right around the corner.

[00:53:25] Josh Lowrey: For you?

[00:53:28] Stephen Preng: Edit that

[00:53:31] Josh Lowrey: Um, you know

[00:53:33] Stephen Preng: You're older than me, so

[00:53:34] Josh Lowrey: I know I am. I'm not pleased with it. It's not great. My shoulder hurts again for no reason. Haven't done anything to it.

[00:53:42] Stephen Preng: Just woke up?

[00:53:42] Josh Lowrey: Just hurts. I slept. Yeah. Took a shower. Can't move it. It's great. Um, Steven Pring, I'll tell you what, it is You know, one of the, what is this, have you learned from watching successful, successful executives?

[00:53:58] Josh Lowrey: I would consider you [00:54:00] one of the people that I have become better at because of watching you. Like, I do. I watch you as a friend. Mm. I watch you as a colleague. Um, I see you in the business. I've seen you for a decade plus. Um, you guys do a great job. Uh, your whole team does, Laura as well. Um, I've actually tried to get Laura to do her own podcast for a long time.

[00:54:21] Stephen Preng: She'd be better at this than me.

[00:54:22] Josh Lowrey: Well, wasn't she a professional-

[00:54:25] Stephen Preng: Yeah, she was a new- ...

[00:54:25] Josh Lowrey: news

[00:54:26] Stephen Preng: anchor? She, she was a news reporter for... She was in Jackson and then Nashville on the NBC-

[00:54:31] Josh Lowrey: Yeah ...

[00:54:31] Stephen Preng: affiliate there.

[00:54:32] Josh Lowrey: Like, she knows what she's doing.

[00:54:33] Stephen Preng: Yeah, yeah.

[00:54:33] Josh Lowrey: I'm faking

[00:54:34] Stephen Preng: it. That, way, way better than me.

[00:54:35] Josh Lowrey: Yeah, we're faking.

[00:54:36] Josh Lowrey: This is fake news.

[00:54:36] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:54:37] Josh Lowrey: Yeah. She's really... She, I, I grabbed the wrong praying. Um, but you did a great job.

[00:54:42] Stephen Preng: Thank you.

[00:54:44] Josh Lowrey: Uh, is there anything you want Caterpillar to know? Do you deal with Caterpillar ever?

[00:54:48] Stephen Preng: Uh, we used to do a lot of stuff from Weir. You know. Yeah. So, uh, know their products. So-

[00:54:54] Josh Lowrey: That's... Man, can we just go back to that, talking about Weir SPM and the frack world [00:55:00] again?

[00:55:00] Josh Lowrey: Those were the days.

[00:55:01] Stephen Preng: Yeah. I w- did a lot of work for Coppinger and Paradis when they were over there, and then-

[00:55:05] Josh Lowrey: Yep ...

[00:55:07] Stephen Preng: um, actually, one of the, one of the guys that, uh, you know, one of my favorite placements, um, um, guy that I've gotten to know well, David Patterson, who's now CEO of Newpark Drilling Fluids. Yeah.

[00:55:19] Stephen Preng: Um, he, I placed over there. When David Paradis moved over to run the flow control- PureFlow,

[00:55:27] Josh Lowrey: yeah, which became Trillium ...

[00:55:29] Stephen Preng: we put David, uh, Patterson in as the president- Ah ... of, of the pressure pumping group.

[00:55:33] Josh Lowrey: I didn't know you did that. I remember that timeframe.

[00:55:35] Stephen Preng: Uh- That's, that's a- ... unfortunately, there were some visa challenges.

[00:55:37] Stephen Preng: Their, their visa, um, immigration lawyer, uh, in my opinion, messed up and put some challenges with David and his family, so he had to leave.

[00:55:46] Josh Lowrey: I remember that. Didn't he have to live in, like, South Asia or something like that?

[00:55:48] Stephen Preng: Uh, his wife and, uh, wife and children were... His wife's Indonesian, so his wife and children were.

[00:55:53] Josh Lowrey: Yeah.

[00:55:53] Stephen Preng: And so what made sense, Newpark's, the, the business that he's running now, you know, Newpark, [00:56:00] SCF bought the drilling fluids business, was headquartered in Rome.

[00:56:03] Josh Lowrey: Mm.

[00:56:03] Stephen Preng: So he could go to Rome, and his family could come there instead of Fort Worth. Yeah. He was, they were stuck, and they couldn't come here. And so- Huh

[00:56:13] Stephen Preng: it was one of those everyone understood. Like, he left, you know, within a year, and everybody's like- What can you do? Yeah.

[00:56:20] Josh Lowrey: Yeah. Would that... Is that a fair question to ask you, what's your biggest or favorite placement you've ever done? I don't wanna put anybody or you on the spot because, like, oh, I, I only like this guy the most.

[00:56:30] Stephen Preng: No, uh, uh, honestly, not to, to be polit- uh, be a politician, I, I, I don't know if I have a favorite one.

[00:56:37] Josh Lowrey: Yeah.

[00:56:37] Stephen Preng: I could probably give you a, a top five or 10.

[00:56:40] Josh Lowrey: Yeah? Okay.

[00:56:41] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:56:42] Josh Lowrey: Well, you don't have to. Um, but that's good to know that there's, like, that you've done, like-

[00:56:46] Stephen Preng: Well, and it goes back to-

[00:56:48] Josh Lowrey: Where it was just a perfect fit

[00:56:50] Stephen Preng: There's, you meet somebody and it's the, like you walk away with the, that-

[00:56:54] Josh Lowrey: Do you wanna give one or two just names where you're like, "This guy or this girl is perfect for this role"?

[00:56:58] Stephen Preng: I'll give you the first one. Okay. First [00:57:00] time, a, a, it, a gentleman, uh, his name was Mike Benjamin. Mike, uh, was an engineer out of Schlumberger, uh, South Louisiana guy, um- Great, just real humble personality. Uh, and TD Williamson hired us to find somebody to run their offshore business. It was a small business.

[00:57:20] Stephen Preng: You know TD Williamson, the- Yeah ... the, uh, pipeline in- midstream pipeline inspection. And they had an offshore business that was, like, inflatable, uh, uh, inflatable pack here. And I, I can't even remember the business. Um, but it was small. It was a Norwegian technology, uh, that they were having a hard time getting going in the Gulf of Mexico s- 'cause the Norwegians, it, it was too expensive- Sure

[00:57:44] Stephen Preng: for the Gulf and everything. And so, uh, my dad and I went up to Tulsa. Uh, I think Charlie came with us, and we, we went and picked that up, uh, and did that search. And Mike came in, and he told [00:58:00] us a story about working on the farm with his uncle. And, uh, and I, I just... As he was going in the first five or 10 minutes, I was like, "This guy's amazing."

[00:58:08] Stephen Preng: This is the guy. Yeah. And sure enough, like, uh, you know, and Charlie had been... You know, I was obviously newer in the business on the, on the, on the executive side. Um, but as soon as we got out there, Mike, you know, left the office and went out the door, I looked at Charlie, and he's like, "Holy..."

[00:58:24] Josh Lowrey: Oh, everyone knew.

[00:58:25] Stephen Preng: Yeah.

[00:58:25] Josh Lowrey: Everyone knew

[00:58:26] Stephen Preng: he was the guy. Just like, "That guy got..." He had it.

[00:58:29] Josh Lowrey: Yeah.

[00:58:29] Stephen Preng: Um, and he ended up going from running that business to, um, I think, running Western Hemisphere for TD Williamson. Maven, if I remember correctly, Maven had become the COO of the organization. Oh, wow. I mean, he did, he did really well and retired from there.

[00:58:44] Stephen Preng: He was a great...

[00:58:45] Josh Lowrey: He was... Oh, really?

[00:58:46] Stephen Preng: Um, yeah.

[00:58:46] Josh Lowrey: Okay, that's a cool story.

[00:58:48] Stephen Preng: Yeah. But he was the first one that as soon... I, I was like, "We can shut it down after this." Yeah. I was like, "Uh, here's your guy." Like, he just had it.

[00:58:56] Josh Lowrey: That's awesome.

[00:58:57] Stephen Preng: Yeah. That's a cool

[00:58:57] Josh Lowrey: story.

[00:58:58] Stephen Preng: And it doesn't happen a lot, [00:59:00] but it happens. Yeah. And when it happens, it's just...

[00:59:02] Stephen Preng: it's pretty cool.

[00:59:03] Josh Lowrey: Well, Steven, thank you for your time. Thank you. Good luck to you guys as a company. Thank you for... By the way, thank you for all these podcasts that everybody sees, whether it be The Energy Pipeline, O360, you know, The It Crowd, Daniel Energy Partners, et cetera. So there's, like, eight or nine different podcasts.

[00:59:17] Josh Lowrey: They, they are all run from the upright studio at Preng & Associates. And I mentioned that earlier, it's not on accident. You guys are phenomenal, just friends and partners of the industry- Yep ... friends and partners of our company. Um, and we just appreciate your time. Thanks for today. Thanks for everything you guys do for us.

[00:59:33] Josh Lowrey: Thanks for

[00:59:34] Stephen Preng: having me.

[00:59:34] Josh Lowrey: Uh, look us up. It, it's prengandassociates.com?

[00:59:38] Stephen Preng: Preng.com.

[00:59:38] Josh Lowrey: Preng, P-R-E-N-G.com. Um, check them out. You're available on LinkedIn. You're, you're really not on many socials. You guys are pretty private. So, uh, you're on LinkedIn for

[00:59:50] Stephen Preng: sure. We're on LinkedIn, and, I mean, you kind of have to in our world.

[00:59:53] Stephen Preng: Uh- Yeah ... and we- Our research team is doing a, a more active job of, of putting us [01:00:00] out there on that. I don't think we're on any of the other socials. No,

[01:00:03] Josh Lowrey: you're not. That's all right. You don't need to be. You're not, you're not-

[01:00:05] Stephen Preng: I don't have the other- You're not

[01:00:06] Josh Lowrey: TikTokking.

[01:00:07] Stephen Preng: I, I don't have the other socials.

[01:00:10] Josh Lowrey: Well, you're missing some pretty good content that I put out, but that's fine.

[01:00:13] Stephen Preng: I've, I've heard about it.

[01:00:14] Josh Lowrey: Yeah. Um, well check out caterpillar.com/oilandgas to... They do a phenomenal job indexing their content, whether it be drilling, executive search, frack, our favorite subject of all time, uh, technology, anything you wanna look at, obviously Caterpillar does a great job.

[01:00:32] Josh Lowrey: Producer Caitlin, great job today. Thank you very much. Stephen Prang, thank you to you and the entire Prang team. I'm Josh Lowery. If you have any great comments, send them to me directly. If you have any hate mail, send that to Producer Caitlin. Thank you very much.